CHAT: Transcript of Career Services Chat #2, July 23, 2007
Transcript of Career Services Chat #2
with Career Services Director Ernest R. Sotomayor, Deputy Director Julie Hartenstein and Coordinator Gina Boubion.
Monday, July 23, 2007
[ See transcript of Career Services Chat #1, July 11, 2007 ]
[ See full list of transcripts and chats ]
mathildep(Q) As a New Media student, the only options I can sign up for are the skills courses. There are some fall electives I’ve very interested in that I can’t take (namely Covering Conflict, which is the type of journalism I’m hoping to get into) so I’m almost tempted to switch to the Newspaper concentration so I can take them instead of the New Media Newsroom one that I’m automatically signed up for, and then make up by taking the new media skills of the journalist. However, would this be a really stupid move, considering how hot new media is right now?
ESotomayor(A) The key is to establish yourself as the strongest reporting and writing candidate as possible. Online media skills are important, but if you are interested in doing reporting abroad, working in a local market to begin with, the most important skills will be reporting and writing. Online media skills are not to be taken lightly, either. If you take the minimum new media skills classes and then continue studying them on your own you would probably have sufficient skills in your starting job.
DeanSree(P) mathildep: I understand your concern about missing out on some electives this Fall when you are doing the New Media Newsroom (this is a similar concern for broadcast majors who can’t choose Fall electives either). But what NM and broadcast majors need to keep in mind is that the Fall electives are a small part of the experience here (10 weeks, for a couple of hours each). Most of our Fall electives are offered in expanded, better formats in the Spring, either as seminars or electives. In the Fall, NM and broadcast majors have fewer choices, but in the Spring, they get to choose in-depth writing and reporting seminars and electives just like everyone else. Also, NM and broadcast majors are welcome to do print Master’s Projects if they wish (remember, all students are guaranteed print projects - students have to pitch and compete for NM or broadcast projects). Hope this helps.
bkp2108(Q) In response to an earlier question, I am curious whether the Covering Conflict course might be offered in the spring as either an Elective or Seminar. Dean Sree said that spring courses are often more detailed/thorough…I have the same issue as the prior person who inquired about the CC course, since I am also in the NM track…
ESotomayor(A) Well, no guarantee right now that it will be offered in the spring. We will know later this year once the spring curriculum is set.
DeanSree(P) To get a SENSE of the courses we are LIKELY to offer in the Spring, see last year’s Spring Curriculum Guide at http://www.journalism.columbia.edu/cs/ContentServer/jrn/1175295325682/page/1175295325665/simplepage.htm We cannot promise we will offer every one of these, but you’ll have a better idea of the choices you will have in the Spring.
sunshine(Q) Do any alums use their degree (non-traditionally) for media/market research, pr or consulting firms? Is there a list of alums who have done so?
gb2219(A) Your degree will be valuable to you in many areas of communication; however, very few alums use their degrees to pursue careers in PR and marketing immediately after graduation. The skills and courses you take here prepare you for journalism jobs, not PR jobs. gb2219(P) Sunshine, to answer the second part of your question, yes, we can track down alumni working in PR and marketing. There is a search service at Columbia that can locate alums in a particular company.
sunshine(Q) What is the average starting salary for new media and broadcast majors?
ESotomayor(A) About the same as for traditional newspaper/magazine reporting jobs and broadcasting jobs. Salaries can begin around $20,000 to $30,000 in small markets, a little higher in NYC or big comparable city, for either print company or broadcast company new media jobs.
ajm2154(Q) How important do you think it is for the topic of a Master’s Project to reflect the type of job one is hoping to find after graduation? That is, should an aspiring sports writer be sure to do a sports project, a political reporter a political project, etc.?
jh548(A) The only hard and fast rule that I think of for master’s projects is that you choose a topic that you are passionately interested in and preferably something that is hasn’t already been the subject of massive amounts of reporting so that you can break some new ground. It is a long and substantive project and you really want to find a subject that you really want to stick with over many months. That said, sure, it would be great to work on a thesis in the area that you hope to break into after graduation. The key is to do first rate reporting –regardless of the subject. That is what will make the difference between a master’s project that will sit on the shelf, as opposed to a thesis that may help you successfully launch your career.
ts2136(Q) Hi there, I read in an earlier Q&A that it isn’t possible for international students to get freelance pieces published while studying in the US (or at least it’s very tricky). How much of a disadvantage do you think this will be when applying for jobs, considering any clips we have will be nearly a year old?
ESotomayor(A) If you are on an F1 student visa you cannot work for pay, including getting freelance fees for stories published. You also cannot write a story and agree to not be paid if everyone else who works with that company as a freelance gets paid. However, there are some companies that take freelance pieces and routinely do not pay. Of course, the stronger a clip file you have at graduation time the better off you will be.
gayle(Q) Hi, have any students been hired at one of the major news networks after graduation?
jh548(A) Hi Gayle: Absolutely. Every year we have graduates land full time paid positions at the major networks, Fox and CNN in various divisions and positions. There are also a number of terrific post-graduate fellowships that you will be eligible to apply for. gayle(Q) A follow-up question: when getting hired in at one of the major networks after graduation, how likely is it to get a position doing some on-air work
jh548(A) Hi Gayle: Unless you have already had several years of on-air reporting experience, or a very special expertise and have broken important stories in print or radio, it is highly unlikely if not impossible to go straight to the networks. To the best of my knowledge, none of our graduates have ever gone directly from J-school to an on-air position at a network–even in their broadband operations. That is highly unrealistic. Most of our broadcast grads seeking to work on air go to small market local stations (DMA’s ranging from 100 and more realistically 150 and higher) all over the country to get their training and then work their way up into larger stations. Alternatively, grads try to land their first on-air jobs at smaller cable outlets in the Northeast.
gayle(Q) To clarify on two earlier answers: it is possible for a student to go to one of the major networks (in New York) but highly unlikely to get an on-air position (if the student has no previous on air experience), is that correct?
jh548(A) Hi Gayle: That is correct. There are usually a few entry level production positions (mostly freelance), several paid summer fellowships and numerous unpaid internships that open up at the networks in NY and DC. Without experience, I’d venture to say it is virtually IMPOSSIBLE to land an on-air position at a network upon graduation.
lam_vo(Q) If we want to apply for a job at university (which is the only option for international students on a student visa to earn some extra cash) where do we look for them?
gb2219(A) The Center for Career Education at Columbia University is where university jobs are posted. The address is www.cce.columbia.edu. Unfortunately, the vast majority of jobs on campus are work-study positions and international students do not qualify for them. Keep an eye out for jobs at the Columbia Libraries–they occasionally post positions that are not work-study.
al(Q) Could you please tell me a little bit more about post-graduate fellowships?
ESotomayor(A) There are many types, and generally they include a stipend or pay of some kind, the deadlines a widely varying and they are available all over the world. Go to this link for more details on the different types of opportunities: http://www.journalism.columbia.edu/cs/ContentServer/jrn/1175295281330/page/1175295281091/simplepage.htm
lmf2125(Q) Hi! I was wondering how soon we should start working with career services–would it be possible to arrange a meeting in the first weeks of our program so that we can be sure to use our time at Columbia to work most effectively towards our career goals? Thanks!
jh548(A) Hi lmf2125: First, get settled and get to know your beat! Next step is to visit our Career Services website and study the links and our guidelines about resumes. Really work on your resume and get it in shape prior to meeting with us. Then please fill out the pre-meeting survey (the link is on our website), upload your updated resume and schedule an appointment. There is no huge rush –but get in to see us as soon as possible. Some of the best post graduate fellowships and paid summer internships have surprisingly early deadlines–they can be due as early as mid-October. So do some homework checking the websites of places you might want to work post graduation, paying particular notice to summer fellowships, and also look at the listings on our website. If you want to apply for some of these programs and they have early deadlines, make that meeting with us as soon as possible so we can work together before you apply. We look forward to meeting you.
lg123(Q) It sounds like many students end up freelancing after graduation… what portion, by your estimate, actually land a job with an employer (benefits, salary)?
ESotomayor(A) We had about 55 percent of the students working in some kind of job at graduation, and nearly all of them are paid at least a modest salary, some are freelancing full time. Nearly all who are in internships or fellowships — a majority of those working — do not have benefits such as health insurance or retirement or worker’s comp. A rough estimate is 10 percent of the students had fulltime, permanent jobs at graduation, including some kind of benefits. And yes, a number of students who don’t have jobs are freelancing. Some of them are freelancing by choice, some as an interim measure while they continue to look for full time employment and some have chosen to freelance at companies in hopes it will pay off in a full time staff position.
gayle(Q) As a broadcast person, am I going to graduate with the same reporting/writing abilities as a newspaper person ?
jh548(A) Hi Gayle: No matter what your concentration, and no matter what media you choose to explore this year , the focus of the J-school curriculum will always be on writing and reporting. So the answer is yes. As a broadcast concentrator, you will obviously get more practice writing for radio and television (and some new media) than print concentrators, and since there are only so many hours in the day, less print reporting experience. But don’t worry. You will be required to deliver plenty of print reporting in RW1, and the majority of seminars and electives spring semester are print based as well.
Ronni_Reich(Q) I’m not sure if this applies to everyone, and feel free to leave it out of the forum. I’m currently interning for a corporate publication. I’ve been told mixed things about whether or not this is something I want on my resume as a journalist. Any thoughts?
gb2219(A) Ronni: It depends. If you want to go into business reporting, for instance, you can easily spin your corporate writing job as relevant work experience. Last year I worked with a student who had worked in PR at a major fashion house in NYC. She wanted to go into fashion journalism. She was able to spin her work experience into one that gave her a close-up view of the industry she hoped to write about as a journalist. She was hired at a daily newspaper that covers the fashion industry. So think along those lines. If you’re not sure, contact one of us for a meeting and we’ll figure it out together.
apl2117(Q) Does that include MA students? Can you tell us how many took positions outside of NYC and where? Thanks
ESotomayor(A) We had students take positions in a number of places around the world in the last couple of years, including MA grads. One went to Dubai, another to Latin America, two have gone on fellowships in Middle East to study languages and freelance. Others from the MS program went to Madrid, Turkey, Israel, Mexico City, Japan, London and a few other places. Roughly a quarter of those who got jobs did so in NYC.
lg123(Q) Which countries, aside from the US, have the highest concentration of j-school grads?
ESotomayor(A) Don’t know exactly, but we have plenty in London, throughout Europe, Canada, and in the Middle East.
mathildep(Q) When you say internships after graduation, do these tend to be paid or unpaid? I’ve done a fair few of unpaid ones and I’m getting a bit weary (and poor!) so I was hoping I would go straight to a job by the time I graduated. I’m now realizing this was a bit too ambitious/hopeful if only 10% of the graduating class find themselves in that position?
ESotomayor(A) The vast majority of the students who get post grad internships are in paid positions. A few are in unpaid but not many.
mathildep(Q) The J-School advises against having a job because the course is too intensive. How do you suggest making ends meet? How realistic is it to hope to get a bit of extra cash by doing only a few hours here and there, for example freelance translation work or language tutoring for those of us who speak another language? gb2219(A) Working part-time during your school year will be very challenging; there’s no doubt about it. Some students do figure out a way to work a little on the side. As expensive as it is to live here, we can’t in good conscience encourage students to start part-time jobs as soon as they arrive — you don’t want to imperil your studies. If you must work, we suggest that you at least wait a few weeks into the semester to get a handle on the work load, then proceed with caution. If you don’t have the time, you can at least try to freelance your coursework. That’ll earn you some nice clips, and a little money in your pocket. For more on that, see our website story called Turning Classwork into Clips.
gayle(Q) Those students who did have full time positions at graduation time, what differentiated them from others? Are they typically the students at the top of the class or are they the students that came into the class with the most experience/clips?
ESotomayor(A) Many factors account for getting a fulltime job: where folks are willing to work, their experience before coming to J school, how skilled they are as reporters and writers, and the medium they are seeking to work in. Many are in fact at the top of the class, the best of the class, who have great work to demonstrate their journalistic abilities. The wider the net you cast, though, the more opportunities you will have. Many focus just on NYC, which is fine, but it is very competitive and very challenging to land full time jobs here.
lmf2125(Q) I’m 30 years old and have worked in journalism-related fields for the past 10 years (magazine publishing and independent documentary filmmaking) but am looking to switch gears a bit and am now entering j-school as a broadcast concentrator. How much does related past experience help in the job search? I can’t imagine going back to interning!!!
jh548(A) Hi lmf2125: Your work experience and life experience are all very valuable. There are no hard and fast rules here–it really depends upon the kind of job you will be looking for, the type of transition that you decide to make and whether or not your previous experience and skill set is relevant to the work you seek to do. But we will certainly try and help translate your work experience into a leg up for you in the job market!
jyk2117(Q) Hello. I have two questions. How early do students start looking for ‘08 summer internships? And is there a listing of internships abroad? -Thanks, Jane
gb2219(A) Jane: Summer ‘08 deadlines start in mid-October and continue through January for daily newspapers; magazines and alt-weeklies tend to have later deadlines, starting in January and running for a couple months. We have a lot of information on internships on our website called A-Z Internships. For a more extensive list of newspaper deadlines, go to www.asne.org and enter your specs. We do not have a list of international internships; students who got them last year either applied through a U.S. based company like The Wall Street Journal or the wire services; others approached the foreign news outlet on their own and struck their own deal.
mathildep(Q) Why don’t you have a list of international internships?
gb2219(A) Because there are very few that are offered to U.S. based students. If you have a particular company in mind and it’s not an American company, we suggest you apply on your own, and state your language skills, your interest and your willingness and ability to relocate.
gayle (Q) What’s the process for applying for a broadcast internship at one of the major networks and how possible is it to parlay an internship into a full time position?
jh548 (A) Hi Gayle: As a broadcast concentrator, it is all but impossible to consider an internship first semester. Depending upon which courses you choose for spring semester, there is a chance you might be able to do an internship, but again under no circumstances should an internship compromise your coursework at the J-school. We will certainly work with you to try and figure out the best path to take. The major networks offer internships in many divisions so check out their websites and look at the opportunities offered. Then come talk to us. In order to qualify for any internship, you’ll need to get permission and guidance from your RW1 advisor and a letter of authorization from Career Services to submit to the networks. Sometimes internships parlay into entry level production positions at the networks but there is absolutely no guarantee.
ts2136(Q) I have a question about the 9-month practical training that overseas students can undertake after graduating. Could you give examples of the kinds of places that international students have ended up (particularly print concentrators)? Also, how willing are US employers to take on people from overseas?
ESotomayor(A) The international program at Columbia is explicitly intended to train journalists and have them return to their home countries to continue the practice of high quality journalism. The vast majority of our international students do just that. Some are able to find temporary employment here in the U.S. following graduation using their work authorization under Optional Practical Training permit. That is good for one year, but finding a job under OPT is a big challenge as many employers do not want to take on foreign workers, even with their OPT work authorization….. However, a few students have managed to land jobs, mostly at very large companies with international operations such as Bloomberg, the AP, Reuters, WSJ. A few smaller companies will on relatively rare occasions take international students on OPT and consider sponsoring them.
ts2136(Q) Hello. I wanted to ask how the MA course is perceived by employers since it is fairly new. Are MA students at a slight disadvantage when it comes to getting jobs since the course is not as established as the MS?
jh548(A) You are right, since the MA program is only two years old, not all employers know about it and aren’t always up to speed about the quality and depth of the specializations and level of prior experience students bring to the program. However, we are promoting and marketing the MA program fast and furiously and more and more employers are getting on board. Also, since we have two classes of fabulous graduates out there doing really well, they are a terrific advertisement for the program.
apl2117(Q) I understand Abigail Tucker won the Berger Award and graduated with honors. She wrote an amazing story. Did this make any difference in her job hunt?
ESotomayor(A) This from her short bio: After graduating from Harvard University, Tucker started her career in journalism in 2003 writing features for the Post Star in Glens Falls, N.Y. The following year, she joined the staff of the Baltimore Sun as a features reporter. The key in Tucker’s case was that she was willing to take a job at a small newspaper in upstate NY, do whatever came along, and did outstanding job at what she did and leverage that into something better. Few grads would have ever landed right out of school full time at the Baltimore Sun, one of the best papers around, but she made it there by taking a side trip to a decent small paper where she earned her stripes.
ESotomayor(P) .. RE Abigail Tucker: And yes, her ability to writing outstanding features was obviously very important. She developed that ability even more after leaving college and that is what landed her the job.
ctaske(Q) Does the J-school arrange very specialized internships for students who would like to cover certain fields of interests or events? For instance, I would love to cover the European Soccer Cup for an American publication in June of ‘08.
gb2219(A) Ctaske: In all honesty, you’d have be very diligent and a little lucky to land a sports-writing job as specialized as the one you suggest right after graduation. If sports is your thing, you probably want to take a sports writing class while you’re here. Also, ESPN has a summer internship and I’ve heard it is beefing up its soccer coverage; so does Sports Illustrated, through the parent company Time Inc. There are other smaller sports magazines, and probably more than one out there that only covers soccer. If you’re committed to writing about soccer, I’d try applying on your own to the smaller publications that cover it. You could also think more broadly — how about writing about the business of soccer for a business magazine or newspaper? Finally, the J-school does not generally arrange internships, but can guide you in your search.
ts2136(Q) Would it be possible for the Careers Service to put me in touch with international students who have managed to get OPT jobs? I’d like to find out how they did it. Is it best to come and see you when I arrive?
ESotomayor(A) Best to come visit later this fall once you are set in school and we can go over this issue more based on your interests and issues.
jk(Q) If we’re unsure specifically what type of job we’d be looking for, is it okay to apply to a wide variety — or do you recommend narrowing our focus when it comes to applying?
ESotomayor(A) You can certainly apply for different types of jobs if you like. JHartenstein(A) That is certainly one approach. But a scattershot process is not generally the most effective way to hit your target. This year as you explore a variety of fields, you will get a much better sense of your interests, strengths and weaknesses and that will help you narrow your focus and be more strategic in your job search.
Graciela_Ibanez(Q) Hi. I’m an international student of the MA program, business concentration. Is it possible to get a summer practice after graduating at one of the main newspapers like the New York Times?
jh548(A) Hi Graciela: At the moment, business journalism is the hottest area for employment and there are lots of jobs out there for our grads at business publications. International students will have a shot at some of these periodicals. A lot of it will depend upon your experience and clips. However, landing a job at The NY Times or other top prestigious papers is always very tough and will present a major challenge.
lmf2125(Q) What sort of freelance work might a broadcast concentrator find after graduation?
gb2219(A) Desk assistant, production associate, news writer, assignment editor or video journalist, web related work, to start. Some broadcast grads also freelance for the print media to hone their reporting and writing skills and make some income.
chd2106(Q) To continue the MA question: Is there any difference in the sort professional expectations the school has for its new M.A. graduates?
jh548(A) Our intention for M.A. graduates is that they land positions that call upon the special expertise they have developed in the program. Our goal is to train beat reporters. Many of our M.A. folks come in with prior experience and substantive clips. These students have the best shot of landing a position in their specialization. If you don’t have much experience, you may need to get some more general assignment reporting under your belt before you can call upon your specialization. Another factor is the medium you seek to work in, with magazines being the toughest nut to crack. It also depends upon how much flexibility you have geographically. If you have your heart set on staying in NY, San Francisco or Boston, your chances of landing a beat reporting position (or general assignment for that matter) are far more limited than if you keep your options open.
ESotomayor(P) Thanks to all for the questions. We look forward to meeting you all at some point in Career Services. Visit our main site at the address below for more answers to your questions.
Have a great summer! /Ernest Sotomayor, Director, Career Services
